Saturday, November 12, 2011

Reader comment:
I must correct you, you have to remember 1 Corinthians 13:8, the ability to prophesy should be abolished. Today we have the Bible John 17:17


ANSWER:


Dear "Anonymous",

Regarding 1Cor.13:8; please consider the Greek and the context:
8 "Love never fails. But whether there are [gifts of] prophesying, they will be done away with; whether there are tongues, they will cease; whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with. 9 For we have partial knowledge and we prophesy partially; 10 but when that which is complete arrives, that which is partial will be done away with. 11 When I was a babe, I used to speak as a babe, to think as a babe, to reason as a babe; but now that I have become a man, I have done away with the [traits] of a babe. 12 For at present we see in hazy outline by means of a metal mirror, but then it will be face to face. At present I know partially, but then I shall know accurately even as I am accurately known.".

You assert that prophesying has already been done away with? Note this phrase:
"whether there is knowledge, it will be done away with."
This is the same description of what is to occur to prophesying. 


Do you also believe that Knowledge has been done away with?
If you read on, he says that he presently "knows" and "prophesies" "partially";

 and in the future, he WILL Know, completely.
A direct clue to what is to be done with prophesying (AND WHEN), is given in the context.
Note:
"when that which is complete arrives, that which is partial will be done away with."


Partial prophesying and partial knowledge therefore, will not be done away with, until complete knowledge and complete prophecy, "arrive". Can you see that? Let's look at this idea further.

The context helps us to understand, how this is interpretation is the truth.
He continues:
11 "When I was a babe, I used to speak as a babe, to think as a babe, to reason as a babe; but now that I have become a man, I have done away with the [traits] of a babe."

When we are young and start grammar school, new knowledge to us, consists of elementary things.
When we advance, those past things are no longer considered the "knowledge" of today, are they?

Once prophecy is fulfilled, is it still prophecy? Or, have those prophesies now been "done away with" by their being fulfilled?

Contemplate this truth regarding the changing condition of both hope, and faith (which exists only while unfulfilled)...
Heb.11:39 "And yet all these, although they had witness borne to them through their faith, did not get the [fulfillment of the] promise".

1Pet.1:21:" so that YOUR faith and hope might be in God."


Note Rom.8:24,25:
24 For we were saved in [this] hope; but hope that is seen is not hope, for when a man sees a thing, does he hope for it? 25 But if we hope for what we do not see, we keep on waiting for it with endurance.'



Please inspect these words:
"hope that is seen is not hope, for when a man sees a thing, does he hope for it?"

Can you see that once hope and faith are REALIZED, then there is no longer a need for faith and hope in those things? They are already done...already "seen".
That faith in the unseen, and hope in what is to come, are then... "done away with"!

Once what we had faith in, arrives...

Once what we hoped for is already given and seen...

They are fulfilled, and are no longer a hope or a belief to put faith in, but have become a reality. Those things are already "seen".
Therefore, what was hoped for is already done, and with the "hope" fulfilled, it is no longer a "hope".

It is the same with prophecy.
Once prophecy is fulfilled, it is no longer a prophecy. Once a prophecy has already come to pass, that prophecy is also..."done away with".

I see you have been taught the popular doctrine that these scriptures declare that "prophecy" no longer exists in our time. Hopefully you can now see that this interpretation of 1Cor.13:8 is a lie,
and not what this scripture is asserting. Jehovah gave visions and prophecies in times past. Despite the claims by men, that He has changed how he deals with his people...
He says otherwise (Isa.41:4; 43:13).

In fact, is not the "end" of our times, rife with prophecies that are yet to be understood and fulfilled?

Why in fact, Rev.11:3 states:
"And I will cause my two witnesses to PROPHESY a thousand two hundred and sixty days dressed in sackcloth.”
Is this verse a lie?

Once all prophecy is understood and is fulfilled, it will no longer be a prediction of the future;
 nor a revealed explanation of the mysteries of God's word, soon to be fulfilled.

Prophecies that were partially understood, will have come to full and clear fulfillment.
(1Cor.13:9,10)
Once clearly fulfilled, the foretelling of those predictions, "will cease".

The time of all prophecies being completely fulfilled, is not yet here, is it?

In harmony with these truths, why does Paul finish by saying:
1Cor.13:13 "Now, however, there remain faith, hope, love, these three;
but the greatest of these is love."?

Why is love the greatest?
Because the other two "cease" when they are fulfilled.
Not so with the manifestation of Love...which may endure forever (Ps.136:16; 100:5).



It is true that we do have John 17:17...
 17 "Sanctify them by means of the truth; your word is truth."


We would therefore rightly expect that any interpretations of prophecy, would use God's Word the Bible as the explanation and interpretation.


Gen.40:8 reads: ": “Do not interpretations belong to God?”
and 
2Pet.1:21: " 21 For prophecy was at no time brought by man’s will, but men spoke from God as they were borne along by holy spirit.".


Therefore, the true interpretation of prophecy will be given by means of scripture, and not by the musing assertions of mere men.


According to the Bible, this activity will happen in the time of the end (Rev.11:3), 
and as it does (John12:48; Rev.20:12; John 12:49; 16:13; Rev.10:7)     
prophecy will be explained and interpreted according to the scriptures
God's Word of truth (John17:17; 2Pet.1:19; Rom.3:4; Rev.19:10), 
revealed by means of His Holy Spirit (2Pet.1:21; 1Cor.2:13).


PART TWO--- (in response to a follow-up question)


Question:
A question along similar lines; Do you feel the other "gifts" have been done away with or are they lying dormant for discretionary use by Jehovah and Jesus?  Or does it seem the Jesus words at Lu.17:6 and Matt. 17:20 may have a bearing on this.




ANSWER:




Luke 17:5 Now the apostles said to the Lord: “Give us more faith.” 6 Then the Lord said: “If YOU had faith the size of a mustard grain, YOU would say to this black mulberry tree, ‘Be uprooted and planted in the sea!’ and it would obey YOU.

Matt.17: 20 He said to them: “Because of YOUR little faith. For truly I say to YOU, If YOU have faith the size of a mustard grain, YOU will say to this mountain, ‘Transfer from here to there,’ and it will transfer, and nothing will be impossible for YOU.” 
                  -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

These scriptures remind me of another of Jesus' sayings:

 John 2:19: "In answer Jesus said to them: “Break down this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.” 

Jesus here was not speaking of a literal, physical feat; but in faith, he knew that as a result of his sacrifice and resurrection; Yhwh's worship would be transformed. 
The "temple" of God's worship would no longer be centered in a literal building of stone. The new temple of God, the Chosen ones (1Cor.3:16,17), were to become the "body" of Christ and the center of true worship, once the blood of the ransom paid for that Covenant. These would become "living stones" (1Pet.2:5) assembled into a spiritual temple as a home for God's Holy Spirit (John14:21,23; Rev.3:20; 1Cor.6:19; 3:16; James4:5; Rom.8:9).
Jesus had faith that by his ransom, this transformation of Jehovah's worship to one of spirit and truth, would occur (John4:23); 
and the center of that worship, would transfer from a "shadow" city on earth, to a "reality" City and Temple in heaven. (Heb.8:5; 9:11,15; Gal.4:26; Heb.12:22,23,24; Rev.21:2,10,22,23,24; 3:12; 1Pet.2:5; Eph.2:19,20,21,22; Rev.21:14)

So too, if these chosen to be a part of this spiritual temple priesthood also have faith like Christ did, additional changes to Jehovah's worship will occur, as found in Luke17:5,6 and Matt.17:20. We will examine that meaning below.

Do Jesus' words, at Luke17:5,6 and Matt.17:20 indicate that faith alone determines what gifts of spirit we possess?

I guess the first thing to establish, is that Jehovah's name infers, that He can do whatever he pleases within the boundaries of his justice and purpose. He has not changed in His ability to give spirit, nor his right to as he sees fit (Isa.41:4). My point is that, he may use his spirit (and it's gifts) according to his own discretion, and not in slavery and obedience to the doctrines of men.

The second thing to establish, is that the said boundaries of Jehovah's justice and purpose, do effect the use of his spirit as regards your question. You see, we are currently under Satan's dominion. He is the current Lord of the physical Creation. Jehovah's jewel of the physical universe is owned by this lying murderer.He has completely subjected it to his dominance. This is the reality.(1John5:19; John12:31) 
It will not change until the dramatic transfer of authority and power that is expounded upon in God's Word, takes place; and it will be accomplished according to the outline the Bible makes so clear. That divine outline will satisfy divine justice, so that it's judgment will be established forever.

  With this divine format in mind, Jehovah's works will always be in harmony with it. His Spirit will not support Satan's rule, nor alleviate it's effects. For our own welfare and education, He has clarified the distinction between Satan's sovereignty, and the Holy one to come. Considering this, we should not expect that physical Kingdom blessings would arrive prematurely...as if they were a part of and in tandem with, Satan's rule.

  I believe the exceptions made in the first century, (while Jesus and the twelve were on earth) were for the purpose of education. The works of these men, teach us hope in the administration to come, as well as provide a foretaste of Jehovah's loving provisions when the Covenant benefits actually do come.
Once these men left physical creation, that light of physical demonstration of hope, also left (Mark2:19,20; John16:20; 12:35,36). The tent of Satan's complete dominion then reclaimed and resumed it's choking grip on all creation. The only exception of spiritual freedom, were those in union with Christ. (John8:32,36; Rom.6:22; 2Cor.3:17; Gal.5:1,13; James1:25; 2:12)

My conclusion is that we will not dispense physical blessings of the future Kingdom now, while Satan rules the world. For Jehovah to do this would violate his righteous justice. Outside of the education the actual presence of Christ the King provided, to do so would be a support to Satan, and a clouding of the fact that creation is awaiting the righteous solution that is divorced completely from the world that is now. 
God's most clear and merciful message of truth, is that we need the removal of Satan's world of sin and death. He makes that clearer by his abandoning of us to the effects of Adam and Eve's choice........the curse of futility (Rom.8:19,20,21,25).
We have need to recognize the stark difference between their choice, and the choice of integrity. That noble, wise choice is not rewarded in this system of darkness; but in the glorious one to come. In His mercy, Jehovah makes that clear. That clarity is manifested in the stark line between the two dominions....Suffering, curse, sorrow, futility, pain, injustice, death, corruption within Satan's Rule (on the basis of hope);
...and relief, salvation, healing, love, compensation, joy.....but only under the righteousness of the future New heavens, by God.

I believe this is why, with the exception of the Son of God/man and the fathers of the new tribes of those sealed; 
we are currently devoid of the physical miracles of the Kingdom.

The third thing to establish, is that Jesus' words above are not without impact! 
But to understand their application, we need to look at the details of what he was saying.

Was it a general allusion to a power he was bestowing on all his brothers, which included a mastery of dispensing the future kingdom blessings prematurely?
I don't believe so, based on the thoughts above.

What then, did he mean?

What "work" would all his brothers be engaged in?
How might that work be impacted by these particular words of his?

The ageless work of the Chosen ones, is that of a soldier.
Every one proving faithful is at war.
Our enemy is Satan....his lies, and his death-dealing weapons that are aimed at destroying the spirits and souls of humankind (especially the heirs).
We are called to battle tirelessly against the power of that darkness.
We are called to be sons of light.
Where light is, darkness can not overpower it. But, darkness always gives way to light, not light to darkness.
This fact we must remember. For it is we who are the light of the world.

I believe this is what Jesus refers to in the verses you quote.
How so?
Jesus was well aware of the adversity, persecution and tribulation his brothers would endure while struggling to promote life and truth.  He knew the perplexing and daunting nature of fighting against the wicked spirit forces. He knew that this war might seem too vast a field...too great a task...to those meek childlike ones.
I believe that these verses impart a courage...a faith and hope...that if we just believe in the backing of our Almighty Father,,,our little expression of faith...our little effort of obedience,...will be matched, no... overwhelmed, with divine assistance and power. But there is so much more detail in these verses, as to how this specifically applies!

The "black mulberry tree" is an interesting reference.
It was known as the fastest growing tree...known to thrive best in Babylon. It's fruit was known to stain the hands and mouth, and anything else it touched. It was also referred to as the "King's berry".
Don't we know of such anointed "trees"? They grow to power, are "attractive"...their fruitful teachings are inviting, and those enticed who partake of the fruit, are certainly stained by it.

Such an influence might seem difficult to battle with. It would be hard to show these up as undermining true humility and truthful words.
Yet Jesus is perhaps saying, that if we have faith that our true ministry has the power to judge and counteract such prominent attractive ones,
we can in essence, transfer the advantaged position of such ones, to 
the realm of the "sea". Drowned and lost in the rest of Satan's pool of untruth and death...no longer able to be parasites of the "earth".

But even better is the other verse.
" YOU will say to this mountain, ‘Transfer from here to there,’ and it will transfer, and nothing will be impossible for YOU.” 

This is the most formidable enemy before us....the counterfeit "mountain"...the counterfeit "Zion".
Satan has erected it, in the hopes of deceiving and carrying off many Chosen ones.
We see the downfall and judgement of this counterfeit mountain, and the anointed associated with it,
at Rev.8:8:
8 "And the second angel blew his trumpet. And something like a great mountain burning with fire was hurled into the sea. And a third of the sea became blood".
Zech4:7

You may be interested in the context.

Yes, despite the massive impressive power of this counterfeit mountain,
the anointed witnesses at war with it have the divine authority to judge these ones,
who have traded their citizenship in heavenly Mt. Zion,
for a bowl of red stew, one hour, with the Wild Beast...one hour, within a mountain under the umbrella of Satan's dominion.

Now I see so clearly why he has promoted the false idea that the Kingdom began in 1914. Yet Jesus said that when we see the signs of the last days, that they are "a beginning of pangs of distress"..."but the end is not yet"! The kingdom does not arrive until the end of the birth pangs of distress, when the Kingdom is finally born. 
Yet we see why Satan would want us to believe that the Kingdom has already started. How else could he follow up with the assertion that this counterfeit mountain is an expression of that Kingdom?

I don't understand how the anointed can believe that while Satan still holds complete control of the world, 
that a prominent power within it, is God's.
Such ones compare to the "wicked steward", who expected his Master sooner.

What an insult to Christ...
to claim that this "organization" is his Kingdom on earth....
that he has already arrived...
that he has already appointed the faithful slave.


How can that even make sense, when those who were supposedly appointed are now all dead, 
and those that have followed have not yet proven faithful?
Jesus tells us when he arrives.
1Cor.11:26 shows that it is not until we are done doing the memorial celebration. 

All the details and extensions of this deception work so well together. They are powerful evidence of the skill, of the father of the lie. 
What a formidable foe!

Yet to return to Jesus' words....
" YOU will say to this mountain, ‘Transfer from here to there,’ and it will transfer, and nothing will be impossible for YOU.” 

How many times did I need to remember these words, when I work to write...
toiling to expose these deadly deceptions?......
feeling like I am a drop of water on a forest fire.
These words of Jesus renew me to finish Jehovah's work.
Jesus promises that Jehovah can use their faith and the work that it fuels,
to "transfer" so great a mountain...
from an established power to deceive and kill,
into a plunge of 
exposure, impotence, and judgement.

And all this 
done just by a witness to truth,
exposing the very foundation made of lies.
                                                      ------------------------------------------------

So in conclusion, my thoughts are these...

The miraculous gifts to be expressed in the kingdom, are not here yet.
This is in harmony with Jehovah's justice, in that he will not support or alleviate the consequences of Satan's rule and mankind's folly.
Jesus and the twelve did demonstrate those blessings in a limited way, for needed educational purposes. We understand the reason why they possessed that power....being the King...God's perfect Son made flesh, then dwelling among us...and those 12 whom he chose to "judge the 12 tribes" of the invited ones, who would be sealed for that future administration.

Yet despite the remaining heirs not having the kingdom powers to come,
they do have a job which they WILL receive divine backing for, according to Jehovah's will and purpose...

that of truth being made manifest, for the judging of Satan's world and all his seed.
In that warfare, we should be confident of our Father's backing.
Just by the "word of our witnessing", we will judge angels...
Satan's angels.
Satan's angels will battle with us, against truth.
For we are Christ's angel messengers.

The great war of God the Almighty, is between Satan and his angels;
and Christ and his angels.
It is a war between lies and truth.
These battles will finally escalate to the final one,
where the remaining ones of the seed will be sealed,
and Satan will lose his heavenly power over physical creation,
to make way for the completed administration.

In that day,
the "black mulberry tree" will be submerged in the deep...no longer able to derive sustenance from the "earth";
and the "mountain" of Satan's counterfeit kingdom of God,
will be set ablaze and transferred to Satan's sea of death.

All that can be accomplished by the puny efforts of childlike ones of faith,
who are backed by the Almighty spirit of Jehovah.

Certainly when truth is championed, Satan's lying machinations are made impotent.
Yet to publish such truths, little insignificant ones must have faith,
to the extent "as (clearly) seeing the one who is invisible".

With obedience and Faith the size of a mustard grain, the faithful chosen can transform Jehovah's worship on earth; 
from a counterfeit mountain lead by trees of influence,
to the removal of that deceptive power...

just a sure as Jesus accomplished the end of the religious system in his day, by his faith and obedience.

The end of the corrupt present system will be followed by,
the new world to come. (2Pet.3:13)


CONCLUSION:


The night I was anointed, I was taken through a series of visions. I will post an article for each one, along with my present understanding of these, according to scripture and spirit. These articles will be added to as Holy Spirit directs.


Vision One: The Great Winepress.
                    To read that article, go to 
                    pearl-winepress.blogspot.com


Vision Two: The Beast Behemoth 
                    (Located in the "Conclusion" at the bottom of   
                     pearl-wildbeast.blogspot.com )


Vision Three: The Deep Abyss (to be released at
                       pearl-leviathan.blogspot.com)


Vision Four: The New Song (to be released at
                     pearl-newsong.blogspot.com)


Vision Five: Thick Gloom; Tempest; Seven Times;
                    The Morning
                    (the vision is partially recorded in the article, 
                     pearl-personalfile.blogspot.com
                 under the anointment account.)
                    More information will follow there, as well
                    as at pearl-seventimes.blogspot.com.


Isa.30:17
Isa.41:4


Attention: The 2/16/12 post at 4womaninthewilderness.blogspot.com
is very relevant to this article.


LINK TO HOME
BACK TO DIRECTORY